We Fell from the Rasa-lila


Feb 14, 2014 — USA (SUN) —

Go back to the rasa-lila to dance with Krishna told Srila Prabhupada to the Beatles, Harrison and Lennon. They understood him and later the Beatles sung: "Get back, get back, get back to where once you belonged."

Here is the complete quote:

    "mam upetya kaunteya duhkhalayam asasvatam [Bg. 8.15] , "he does not come back again to this miserable condition." And asasvatam, temporary. Why? Samsiddhim paramam gatah. Oh, he has attained the highest perfection, to go back to Krishna, mad-yajino 'pi mam, "one who comes to Me." So this is the greatest benediction to the human society, to train them to go back to Krishna and dance there with Krishna in rasa-lila."
    (Room Conversation with John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison)

Here a few more on leaving the rasa dance:

    "Those who have got little brain, they are satisfied with temporary, and those who are advanced, yogis, they are not satisfied with temporary happiness. They must be seeking for unlimited happiness. That can be achieved when you [go] back to home, back to Krishna. Krishna is eternal, His pastimes are eternal. Just join with Krishna, His rasa dance, His play with cowherd boys, His dealing with His father and mother in Vrindavana. So our, this movement is to join Krishna's pastimes."
    (Arrival lecture, Los Angeles, 1973.4.13)

    "Because we are now detached from Krishna, therefore our position is manah shashthanindriyani prakriti-sthani karshati [Bg. 15.7]. Detached from Krishna, we are in this prakriti, material nature, and our business is struggle for existence for the same pleasure, which is never obtainable in this material world. Therefore the intelligence is that we should again go back to home, go back to Krishna, and dance with Him in His rasa dance.
    (Lecture, SB 3.26.19)

    "The Lord wanted to create the cosmic manifestation to give another chance to the conditioned souls who were dormant in forgetfulness. The cosmic manifestation gives the conditioned souls a chance to go back home, back to Godhead, and that is its main purpose. The Lord is so kind that in the absence of such a manifestation He feels something wanting, and thus the creation takes place. Although the creation of the internal potency was manifested, the other potency appeared to be sleeping, and the Lord wanted to awaken her to activity, just as a husband wants to awaken his wife from the sleeping state for enjoyment. It is the compassion of the Lord for the sleeping energy that He wants to see her awaken for enjoyment like the other wives who are awake. The whole process is to enliven the sleeping conditioned souls to the real life of spiritual consciousness so that they may thus become as perfect as the ever-liberated souls in the Vaikunthalokas. Since the Lord is sac-cid-ananda-vigraha [Bs. 5.1], He likes every part and parcel of His different potencies to take part in the blissful rasa because participation with the Lord in His eternal rasa-lila is the highest living condition, perfect in spiritual bliss and eternal knowledge."
    (SB 3.25.4 purport)

Back to home, back to Godhead where there is the rasa-lila. 'Back to' means we return from where we came. Also the description of the Lord with many wives. Other wives are awake. One wife (or many conditioned souls) is sleeping. She is of course not eternally sleeping, or since birth. She was awake before, had fallen asleep and becomes reawakened.

Go back home, back to Godhead and be cheerful in Vrndavana dancing in rasa-lila or seeing Krishna dancing on Kaliya (who is also in Vrindavana see Brihad bhagavatamrta 3.6.356). 'Back to' means we came from there.

    "You have to go back to home, go back to Krishna, and there is your real life. Krishna comes therefore. He displays His rasa dance in Vrindavana to attract these fallen souls, that "If you want enjoyment, why not come back to Me? Here is the enjoyment. Here is the enjoyment, eternal enjoyment. Why you are rotting in this material world and becoming implicated, sometimes as Brahma and sometime as the worm in the stool? Enjoyment, varieties of enjoyment. Why? Why you are so become fool?""
    (Hyderabad, April 23, 1974, Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.2.9)

To summarize, Krishna says come back to my rasa dance in Vrndavana. We have been there. Then we wanted to enjoy this rotting matter.

    "The intelligence is that we should again go back to home, go back to Krishna, and dance with Him in His rasa dance."
    (Bombay, December 28, 1974, Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.26.19)

Just like a mad son loitering in the street, when he understands with good brain that "My father is so rich, so powerful, and why I am loitering in the street like a madman? I have no food, no shelter. I am going from this door to door and begging," then he comes to his consciousness. That is called brahma-bhuta [SB 4.30.20] stage. "Oh, I am, I am not this matter. I am spirit soul, part and parcel of God. Oh." That is consciousness.

    "This consciousness we are trying to arouse. This is the best welfare service to the people, to awaken his lost consciousness. He is foolishly thinking that "I am of the material product, and I have to adjust my things in this material world." This is the foolishness. Actual intelligence is that is Brahma-bhuta, aham brahmasmi. Bhagavata.: "I am part and parcel of God. God is supreme Brahman. I am, being part and parcel..." Just like part and parcel of the gold, gold mine, it may be small earring, it is also gold. Similarly, the small particle of sea water is also the same quality, salty. Similarly, we, being part and parcel of God, we have got the same qualities. Qualitatively, we are one. Why we are hankering after loving? Because there is love in Krishna. We are worshiping here Radha-Krishna. Originally there is love. Therefore we, being part and parcel of God, we are also trying to love. A man is trying to love another woman, woman is trying to love another man. This is natural. This is not artificial. But it is perverted in the material covering. That is the defect. When we are free from this material covering, then we are qualitatively anandamayo 'bhyasat (Vedanta-sutra 1.1.12), as jolly... As Krishna is dancing always... Krishna you will never find... You have seen the picture of Krishna. He is fighting with the Kaliya serpent. He is dancing. He is not afraid of the serpent. He is dancing. As He is dancing with the gopis in rasa-lila, similarly, He is dancing with the snake. Because He is anandamayo 'bhyasat. He is anandamaya, always jolly. Always. You will see Krishna... Krishna... Just like in Kurukshetra the fighting is going on. Krishna is jolly. Arjuna is morose because he is living entity, but He is not morose. He is jolly. That is the nature of God. Anandamayo 'bhyasat. This is the sutra, in the Brahma-sutra, that "God is anandamaya, always jolly, always cheerful." So you can become also cheerful when you go back to home, back to Godhead."
    (Srimad-Bhagavatam 2.1.5, Delhi, November 8, 1973)

Then Srila Prabhupada said in his Srimad Bhagavatam purport that "no one falls from the spiritual world."

No one means no devotees descend. But "sometimes, as the Lord desires, devotees come into the material world as preachers (Lord Buddha) or atheists (like Jaya and Vijaya). Of course, the fools and crazies who disturb the society, friendship and love of Vaikuntha are to fall and will be imprisoned in the lunatic asylum of the material world. In Isvara dasa's "Fall or No Fall" the context of this statement and purport is not studied. That rebels are expelled, Srila Prabhupada will state in SB. 3.16.35: "Here is clear proof of how a living entity coming originally from Vaikunthaloka (=planets) is encaged in material elements."

And in SB 3.16.37…will go back to Godhead, back to the Vaikuntha planets.

In the Vedabase we find this concept 6453 times.

    back to Goloka Vrndavana – 1 time

    back to Krsnaloka – 2 times

    back to Krsna's loka, back to home – 1 time

    go back to my planet – 1 time

    back to the rasa dance – 5 times

    go back to Jagannatha – 1

    back to the Vaikuntha planets – 7 times

    back to Krsna – 97 times

    back to Krishna – 9 times

    back to the kingdom of Krsna – 1 time

    back to our eternal home in the kingdom of Krsna – 1 time

    return to the kingdom of God – 8 times

    back to the kingdom of God – 16 times

    back to the kingdom of Godhead – 5 times

    back to Godhead – 2921 times

    back to home back to godhead – 970 times

    return to the spiritual world – 8 times

    back home – 691 times

    back home back to godhead – 528 times

    all spirit souls are coming from Vaikuntha – 1

    back to home – 1137 times

    back to our permanent home – 1 time

    back to our original home, back to God – 2 time

    back to our original home, back to Godhead – 1 time

    back to the spiritual world – 21 times

    back to Vaikuntha – 9 times

    back to the Vaikuntha – 1 time

Srila Prabhupada uses these different terms but describes in these ways the same concept. For example in the philosophy discussion on Schopenhauer Srila Prabhupada says:

    "There are two kinds of sects: this Mayavadi and the Vaishnava. So both of them know that this material world is flickering, and sometimes they say it is false, unreal. So there is another life; that is spiritual world. So the Mayavadi philosopher, their spiritual life means to merge into the Brahman effulgence, and the Vaishnava philosopher to go back to Goloka Vrindavana, Vaikuntha, where God is situated, and become His associate person. So both the ideas, spiritual ideas, that is attained after death."

Back to Goloka Vrindavana where we came from.

In the same discussion he also says three times back to home, back to Godhead. Back to Godhead is thus very specific, Krishna's planet, Goloka Vrindavana. Not the outskirts of the brahmajyoti. That is what he says here.

    "If you simply try to have full knowledge about Krishna, then his willing, this material willing is purified, and after giving up this body he goes back to home, back to Godhead."

    "If I meet death in sound health, then I can think of my next life, go back to home, back to Godhead, and I achieve it. Because at the time of death my thinking will be taken into consideration. So if by thinking of Jagannatha if I die, then I go back to Jagannatha.

    Hayagriva: Yes.

    Prabhupada: That is not suicide. That is voluntarily accepting death so that immediately he can return back to the spiritual world."

"Go back to Jagannatha" means we have fallen down from Jagannatha, we have not come originally from brahmajyoti.

"Return back to the spiritual world" means thus that we come originally from Narayana's or Krishna's loka (=planet) not from the brahmajyoti. Srila Prabhupada uses this word "returning" to our original position 3 times; "return back to the spiritual world" 2 times and "original position" 205 times.

In all his writings and speeches Srila Prabhupada uses the following list of words to describe the fall of the soul from the spiritual planets 12,527 times.

    Forget Krishna or Krishna consciousness – 637; Forgotten – 674; Forgetful – 119; Forgetfulness – 315; Reclaim – 81; Regain – 89; Revival – 46; Revive – 407; Reinstate – 10; Renovate – 20; Averse – 73; Misuse his independence – 57; Reestablished – 20; Lost – 322; Paradise lost – 19; Dormant – 428; Disagreed – 6; Sleep – 58; Sleeping – 62; Awakened – 297; Imprisoned – 26; Prison – 88; Condemned – 86; Unfettered – 1; Regain – 89; falls down – 86; original Krsna consciousness – 581; original consciousness – 149; original position – 207; come down – 57; return – 171; recover – 25; revert – 15; reunion – 6; again (to Krishna or Krishna consciousness) – 68; fallen conditioned 211; 65; fallen souls – 465; Back to Krishna consciousness – 7; Back to Krishna – 99; Rebel – 11; Rebellious – 32; back to Goloka Vrndavana – 1; back to Krsna loka – 2; back to the rasa-lila – 5; go back to Jagannatha – 1; go back to my planet – 1; back to the Vaikuntha planets – 7; back to Krishna – 9 times; back to the kingdom of Krsna – 1 time; back to our eternal home in the kingdom of Krsna – 1 time; return to the kingdom of God – 8 times; back to the kingdom of God – 16 times; back to the kingdom of Godhead – 5 times; back to Godhead – 2921 times; back to home back to godhead – 970 times; return to the spiritual world – 8 times; back home – 691 times; back home back to godhead – 528 times; all spirit souls are coming from Vaikuntha – 1; back to home – 1137 times; back to our permanent home – 1 time; back to our original home, back to God – 2 time; back to our original home, back to Godhead – 1 time; back to the spiritual world – 21 times; back to Vaikuntha – 9 times; back to the Vaikuntha – 1 time.

In this SB 3.16.26 purport Srila Prabhupada discusses the descent or fall of devotees.

The text translation makes this clear immediately.

Krishna speaks: "O Kumaras, know that the punishment inflicted on these two gatekeepers was originally ordained by Me and therefore these two (devotees, for pastimes) will "fall" to a birth in a demoniac family…"

Then the whole of the purport is explaining that the Lord wanted to sport, mock fight and to exercise the muscles. As Srila Prabhupada jokingly explains; to keep the body fit to work out on a devotee taking the role of a demon. No one but a devotee can be a proper opponent; they have similar powers (see Brihad Bhagavamrta 2.4.200-201 / 1.3.45, 57)

Then Srila Prabhupada writes "that a devotee should come into an atheist family is surprising" because "no one (of the devotees) falls from the Vaikuntha planets" but "sometimes, as the Lord desires devotees come into the material world…"

All the chapters and commentaries of our sampradaya-acarya's on this lila explain fall-vada from the spiritual planets.

In SB 3.16.26 Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti writes on the 4 Kumaras who offered 10 beautiful, prayers. They didn't know of the fighting rasa between the Lord and Jaya and Vijaya's expansions (the 2 Hiranyas, Ravana and Kumbhakarna, Sisupala and Dantavakra, Jagai and Madhai). But they know the philosophy of Krishna consciousness.

They thought: "Even the greatest devotees can fall from Vaikuntha because of great offense! What then to speak of where we, who are just dull reflections of sadhakas, can fall from this earth planet!"

Our comment: I.o.w it is common knowledge that devotees becoming demoniac fall from Vaikuntha-loka. As we here in our worlds know that if we do crime or break the law we get jail or a fine.

Srila Prabhupada in the purport to SB 3.15.33 writes:

    "Just as there are different departments in each state in this material world—the civil department and the criminal department—so, in God's creation, there are two departments of existence. All living entities who are residents of the material universes are considered to be more or less criminals because they do not wish to abide by the order of the Lord or they are against the harmonious activities of God's will. The principle of creation is that the Supreme Lord, the Personality of Godhead, is by nature joyful, and He becomes many in order to enhance His transcendental joy. The living entities like ourselves, being part and parcel of the Supreme Lord, are meant to satisfy the senses of the Lord. Thus, whenever there is a discrepancy in that harmony, immediately the living entity is entrapped by maya, or illusion."

"Discrepancy in that harmony of satisfaction and transcendental joy"

This cannot refer to the causal ocean, as Brahmajyoti fall-vadis try to insert, because huge waves and mighty winds give no joyful harmonious home. The causal ocean is especially in a turmoil at the time of creation; millions of universes and souls come from Maha-Visnu's pores.

The subtle forms of all these souls and universes (golden cosmic eggs) enter the womb chamber of maya or causal ocean to be clothed or enveloped with the eight mundane elements (see Brahma samhita txt 13)

No one falls from Vaikuntha, we also read in SB 7.1.35 purport.

The chapter's subject is on Yudhisthira's cousins Sisupala and Dantavakra, who were formerly associates of Lord Visnu, falling from Vaikuntha to the material world, due to a curse by the Kumaras.

Then Yudhisthira inquires in text 34, how can devotees fall to this material world.

    "Maharaja Yudhishthira inquired: What kind of great curse could affect even liberated vishnu-bhaktas, and what sort of person could curse even the Lord's associates? For unflinching devotees of the Lord to fall again to this material world is impossible. I cannot believe this." (34)

    "The bodies of the inhabitants of Vaikuntha are completely spiritual, having nothing to do with the material body, senses or life air. Therefore, kindly explain how associates of the Personality of Godhead were cursed to descend in material bodies like ordinary persons." (35)

It is impossible that unflinching ekantika devotees fall. Only rebels fall. Also devotees cannot be cursed. No evil can happen to devotees. Only if they turn rebel, then they are not unflinching devotees. Or for pastimes as in the case of Jaya and Vijay. Nor are there demons who curse.

One cannot take text 35 "the bodies of the Vaikuntha inhabitants are spiritual how they were cursed to descend in material bodies" to mean that spiritual bodies can't fall into material bodies.

Other translations of this verse also don't give this understanding.

    Yudhisthira said: What kind of and whose curse was it that prevailed (even) against the servants of Lord Sri Hari? The incarnation of those exclusively devoted to Sri Hari appears as something incredible. (33)

    Be pleased to narrate the episode connected with the corporeal existence of the denizens of Vaikunthapura (the abode of Lord Visnu), devoid (as they are) of a (material) body, indriyas and life-breath. (34)
    (SB by Gitapress)

    33. It appears certainly incredible that those who are exclusively devoted to Hari, were compelled to be born again. Therefore (please tell us) whose curse it was and what was the nature of the imprecation which overpowered the servants of Hari.

    34. The residents of the city or region called Vaikuntha are of pure sattvic form and are devoid of material body, senses and the like. You should narrate to us how it led to the assumption of corporeal existence (in the case of such residents of Vaikuntha).
    (Bhagavata Purana, Motilal edition by board of translators)

    Sri Yudhishthira said: Who pronounced the curse against them which was so powerful that it could affect the downfall of the devotees of Lord Vishnu and what was the nature of that curse as it appears unthinkable? Be gracious to enlighten us in this matter that how those dwellers in Vaikuntha, who had no physical bodies and physical organs of sense and action, came to be saddled with corporeal bodies. 34-35
    (SB by Bhakti Prajnana Yati Swami)

    The auspicious Yudhisthira asked:—Who was he that imprecated the said curse, and what was its nature that it was able to overpower even the servants of Lord Sri Hari? That even those worshippers of Lord Sri Hari, who adored Him with a singleness of purpose, were compelled to be born, seems un¬worthy of belief. Thou ought to relate to us all, as to how they, the dwellers of excellent Vaikuntha and devoid of the material body, senses and life, became possessed of bodies.
    (SB by Sanyal)

Spiritual bodies can fall because even in Brahmajyoti-fall-vada the eternally folded up or contracted spiritual body is said to descend (sometimes, if the soul chooses for maya at the viraja-river) into a material body. The wrong choice at the border means the contracted body develops to see Krishna, the soul refuses and becomes shrunk and dormant.

And even those who developed their spiritual body (their nitya svarupa) dwell in (spiritualized) material bodies. So those with a spiritual body in Vaikuntha can descend in material bodies.

Thus the inquiry is on how spirit can be incorporated into matter and on how devotees can fall for the material world. So devotees don't fall, rebels fall.

That rebels in the spiritual world are imprisoned in the prison house (=Durga) of the material world is already understood from previous purports.

In SB 7.1.25 purport Srila Prabhupada says:

    "…takes the conditioned soul back home, back to Godhead and…Vritrasura was taken back to Godhead.

    …and a demon or conditioned soul becomes completely pure, the Lord takes him back to Godhead."

SB 7.1.26 purport:

    "…Jaya Vijaya…then returned home, back to Godhead. They came from the Vaikuntha planets and they returned home, back to Godhead."

Similarly the conditioned souls, described in the purport before 7.1.25 came from that home the spiritual planets and went back to their home.

Later in 7.1.26 purport again he says about conditioned souls:

    "…desire to return home, back to Godhead."

And in 7.1.33 purport he writes:

    "…Sisupal and Dantavakre were formerly personal associates of Lord Visnu. They apparently fell to this material world, but actually they came to assist Krishna in His pastimes."

"Apparently they fell to this material world." This is ABCD.

As all souls we find in this world have fallen down from above down; because renegades are send off or out to the penal colony of the material world. But no, not these ones, they came to assist Krishna in His pastimes.

And in the previous verse to 7.1.33, in 7.1.32 he translates:

    "for unflinching devotees of the Lord to fall again to this material world I can't believe."

"Fall again" means they already once had fallen down. They had returned. To fall again is unbelievable. I.o.w the soul can fall away one time, easily or generally from the spiritual world. But once burnt twice shy. Who would go again into the nightmare of the material world.

Then in the purport he repeats this point:

    "…he was surprised that a pure devotee could return to this material world."

"…one purified returns home, back to Godhead."

And in this 7.1.35:

    "Associates of Lord Visnu who descend from Vaikuntha do not actally fall" as associates who became rebels actually fall.

It is understood from this sentence phrased like this that fall does take place but associates of Lord Visnu, who remain servants, do not fall.

In the purport to 7.1.35 Srila Prabhupada writes that "associates of the Lord Visnu who descend from Vaikuntha don't actually fall. They come with the purpose of fulfilling the desires of the Lord…When Jaya and Vijaya descend, there was something to be done for Krsna. Otherwise it is a fact that no one (of the Lord's associates, who don't become envious, – ed.) falls from Vaikuntha." How can it be otherwise. Srila Prabhupada explains the fall of the soul 1000s of times.

This "otherwise it is a fact that no one falls from Vaikuntha," Srila Prabhupada faithfully repeats from the verse. He reveals and repeats this at the end of the purport to SB 7.1.35.

    "Otherwise that an unflinching servant of the Lord could fall from Vaikuntha seems unbelievable, as Maharaja Yudhishthira says, asraddheya ivabhati harer ekantinam."

This verse means, as we already explained, ekantika one-minded unflinching devotees don't fall. Those who don't want to surrender any longer to ekala isvara krsna the only Lord Krishna, fall from grace. So this "no one falls" means "no devotees fall" but rascals are kicked out from Sri Sri Radha Krishna's paradise, Goloka Vrindavana.

Srila Prabhupada repeats this point, (that loyal associates don't fall) at the end of his purport to this verse 35.

"…Jaya and Vijaya descended to the material world to serve the Lord by fulfilling His desire to fight. Otherwise, as Maharaja Yudhisthira says asraddheya ivAbhAti: the statement that an ekantika unflinching servant of the Lord could fall from Vaikuntha seems unbelievable." Because ekantika unflinching servants don't fall. But, of course, demons are exiled.

Yuddhistira knows that spiritual bodies gets contracted and in this way the spiritual bodies, 1/1000 part of the tip of the hair (kesagra-sata-bhagasya) as a small spiritual atom get into a material body. Of course the soul is spiritual and of another dimension; it fits everywhere in matter. Yuddhistira asks this question to Narada Muni on behalf of the common ignorant man, to be published and broadcasted in the Bhagavatam. How spiritually developed big bodies get into small baby bodies.

Isavara dasa wrote that 'Lord Krishna also said in the Bhagavad-gita Chapter fifteen that His abode is the supreme abode that having once being, one never returns.'

He probably means Bg. 15.6 but that is another subject; not the first coming here.

Then he wrote that 'the Kingdom or God or the spiritual world is a place of never-ending perfection where there can be no possibility of defects that will warrant one becoming envious of Krishna and then falling into the material world.'

So yes, the spiritual world is perfect but we are not perfect because we are not part of the spiritual world. We are eternally marginal energy, tatastha sakti. The spiritual saktis or sakti tattvas of Krishna never fall, nor the Visnu tattvas.

In the words of Bhaktivinoda Thakura the jiva is apurna sakti not perfect or complete. (purna=complete)

Marginal means as the beach; sometimes covered by water and sometimes being land.

Isvara dasa wrote that: 'If we assume that the jivas do indeed fall from the spiritual world, then what is the meaning of "having once gone, one never returns"? If we fell from there before, it means we can fall from there again, as some maintain that since souls have independence, they can always misuse that independence, then become envious of Krishna in trying to enjoy like Him. Now, if we can perpetually go to the spiritual world to be in the association of Krishna and can always fall from that real…'

To answer this Srila Prabhupada explains in his philosophical discussions on Bergson:

    Prabhupada: Krsna comes down and instructs us, "But why you are engaged in this foolish activity? Please come to Me, back to home, back to Godhead…So originally the spirit soul has got body, so these physical elements are just like a covering, exactly to the size of the hands, legs, everything…The future is to go back to home, back to Godhead…because he is eternally servant of God, so now he has forgotten. He wants to become master, and the material nature is kicking him, life after life. So one day he'll come to his senses and become again, renovate himself to become servant of God…Just like when a man becomes a prisoner, he'll be a free man at the end of his term, and within this term he is simply kicked by the police, so that he may not come back again to prison house.

    Syamasundara: But we can't predict that the process of punishment will have permanent effect, can we? Can we predict that? Many prisoners leave the prison, but some come back.

    Prabhupada: No, there is no permanent effect because we have got little independence. There is nothing as permanent. You can misuse your independence at any time.

    Syamasundara: And come back.

    Prabhupada: Yes. Otherwise there is no meaning of independence. Independence means you can do this, you can do that. "All right. Whatever you like."

    Devotee: Then he is so many times falling down, again and again, eventually permanently he will come back.

    Prabhupada: No. There is no question of permanent. Because he has got independence, he can misuse his independence, he can fall down. That's why one man is released from the prison house, that does not mean permanently He can come back again.

    Prabhupada: This is the general law [to not come back]. But if he likes, he can come back. Because otherwise, what is the meaning of independence? Just like one should become fit in the prison house, naturally he should not go again.

He also explains the same in the following conversation:

    Prabhupada: There is return, that is voluntary. Return there is.

    Paramahamsa: If we want.

    Prabhupada: Yes.

    Paramahamsa: So we can come to the spiritual world and return?

    Prabhupada: Yes.

    Paramahamsa: Fall down?

    Prabhupada: Yes. As soon as we try, "Oh, this material world is very nice," "Yes," Krishna says, "yes, you go."

    Paramahamsa: Fall down?

    Prabhupada: Yes. As soon as we try, "Oh, this material world is very nice," "Yes," Krishna says, "yes, you go." Just like nobody is interested in Krishna consciousness. Do you think everyone is interested? So. They want to enjoy this material world. Otherwise what is the meaning of free will? Every living entity has got a little free will. And Krishna is so kind, He gives him opportunity, "All right, you enjoy like this." Just like some of our students, Krishna conscious, sometimes go away, again come back. It is free will, not stereotyped. Just like one goes to the prisonhouse, not that government welcomes, "Come on. We have got prisonhouse. Come here, come here." He goes out of his free will; again comes out, again goes. Like that. Krishna-bahirmukha hana bhoga vancha kare, nikata-stha maya tare japatiya dhare (Prema-vivarta). The police is there. Just like the police car was there. We have nothing to do with it. But if you do anything criminal, immediately you will be arrested, under police custody. The maya may be there, but maya captures him who is not a devotee of Krishna. (Morning Walk, At Cheviot Hills Golf Course, May 13, 1973, Los Angeles)

Isvara dasa remarks "It is really crazy!"

Yes, it is really crazy to have come here. It is unbelievably really crazy to think of how this could have happened to me who is so clever. In our Caitanya's acintya bheda-abheda tattva sampradaya there is acintya inconceivability on all levels. This acintya distinguishes us from all other 3 sampradayas. So there is also acintya on the part of the jiva, who is part and parcel of the Supreme acintya, incredible, inconceivable Krishna who is unbelievably mad with love for Srimati Radharani. So we can also do the inconceivable and become inconceivably foolish to freely choose not Krishna, become inconceivably crazy with lust and turn away from the inconceivably attractive Krishna.

To conclude, here are some more quotes on falling from the spiritual planets.

Darsan. July 6, 1976

    Devotee (4): I can't seem to get a grasp on this at all. If we in our original constitutional position as part and parcel of Krishna, and in that position, that original position of full knowledge and full bliss and being in our eternal nature...

    Prabhupada: Whatever it may be, the falldown is there. So because we are living entities, we are not as powerful as Krishna, therefore we may fall down from Vaikuntha at any moment. Iccha-dvesha samutthena sarge yanti parantapa. Find out this verse.

    Pushta Krishna:

    iccha-dvesha samutthena
    dvandva-mohena bharata
    sarva-bhutani sammoham
    sarge yanti parantapa
    [Bg. 7.27]

    "O scion of Bharata [Arjuna], O conqueror of the foe, all living entities are born into delusion, overcome by the dualities of desire and hate."

    Prabhupada: So even in the Vaikuntha, if I desire that "Why shall I serve Krishna? Why not become Krishna?" I immediately fall down. That is natural. A servant is serving the master, sometimes he may think that "If I could become the master." They are thinking like that, they are trying to become God. That is delusion. You cannot become God. That is not possible. But he's wrongly thinking.

    Vipina: Why doesn't He save me from thinking like that?

    Prabhupada: That means you lose your independence.

    Prabhupada: That is force. [indistinct] prema. In Bengali it is said "If you catch one girl or boy, 'You love me, you love me, you love me.' " Is it love? [laughter] "You love me, otherwise I will kill you." [laughter] Is that love? So Krishna does not want to become a lover like that, on the point of revolver, "You love me, otherwise I shall kill you." That is not love, that is threatening. Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling, then there is love, not by force.

    Vipina: We also say that Krishna is fulfilling the desires of every living entity. So if we want to enjoy independent of Krishna, why doesn't He let us really enjoy independent of Him?

    Prabhupada: That is not possible. That is maya it is called. You are not enjoyer, you are servant. Because you are willing to become enjoyer, you suffer, that's all. You are not enjoyer.

    Vipina: Then He's not fulfilling the desire.

    Prabhupada: No, you wanted to enjoy-enjoy at your risk. Sometimes you'll become the king of heaven, and sometimes you become the germs in the stool.

Bg 17.1-3 lecture, July 4, 1974, Honolulu

    "If you do not stick to the spiritual principle, even if you are in Vaikuntha, you will fall down, what to speak of this material world? Because in the Vaikuntha or in the spiritual world, no contaminated soul can stay there…Just like Jaya-Vijaya. Jaya and Vijaya became asuras. They fell down from Vaikuntha. But they became asuras under the circumstances…That is mentioned we were reading Bhagavata the Kasyapa Rishi, his wife... Diti"

SB 3.16.6 p

    "Similarly, there was no necessity to create this material world for the sufferings of the conditioned souls, but at the same time there are certain living entities, known as nitya-baddha, who are eternally conditioned. We say that they have been conditioned from time immemorial because no one can trace out when the living entity, the part and parcel of the Supreme Lord, became rebellious against the supremacy of the Lord. It is a fact that there are two classes of men... Without tracing out the beginning of the existence of these two classes, we can take it for granted that some of the living entities revolted against the laws of the Lord. Such entities are called conditioned souls... Covered by the material body, the spiritual identity is lost, and therefore the word mumuhe is used here, indicating that they have forgotten their own spiritual identity."
    (Bhag. 3.26.5, purport)

SB 2.9.1 p

    "Like a person who thinks of becoming a king without possessing the necessary qualification, when the living entity desires to become the Lord Himself, he is put in a condition of dreaming that he is a king. Therefore the first sinful will of the living entity is to become the Lord, and the consequent will of the Lord is that the living entity forget his factual life and thus dream of the land of utopia where he may become one like the Lord. The child cries to have the moon from the mother, and the mother gives the child a mirror to satisfy the crying and disturbing child with the reflection of the moon. Similarly, the crying child of the Lord is given over to the reflection, the material world, to lord it over as karmi and to give this up in frustration to become one with the Lord."

SB 3.7.9 p

    "It is the misfortune of the living entity, certainly not without reason, that the influence of the material energy acts on his pure consciousness and eternal bliss."

SB 3.7.10 p

    "Actually there is no bondage or misery for the living entity, nor does he ever lose his pure knowledge…a living entity is eternally subordinate to the Supreme Lord, and he has this knowledge with him,"

SB 3.7.12 p

    "Because the application of devotional service to Lord Vasudeva invites pure knowledge, it quickly detaches one from the material conception of life and thus revives one's normal condition of spiritual existence,"

SB 3.7.15 p

    "The Lord is the eternal predominator, and the living entities are eternally predominated. Real knowledge of this relationship entails reviving the lost consciousness to this standard, and the process for such revival is devotional service to the Lord."

SB 1.2.31 p

    "…conditioned living entities, who are unfit for the spiritual kingdom, are strewn within the material world to enjoy matter to the fullest extent."

SB 1.7.5 p

    "…the actual knowledge of the conditioned soul is now covered by nescience…the living entity has his own way of thinking in his original unconditional state also…The Lord does not desire that a living being be illusioned by external energy. The external energy is aware of this fact, but still she accepts a thankless task of keeping the forgotten soul under illusion by her bewildering influence…performances of the illusory energy are also necessary for reformation of the conditioned soul…An affectionate father does not like his children to be chastised by another agent, yet he puts his disobedient children under the custody of a severe man just to bring them to order…the living entity is also required to revive his natural love and affection for the Lord,"

SB 1.10.13-14 p

    "…revival of one's eternal relation with Him, now forgotten under the spell of maya…Our intimate relation with Krishna can be confidentially revived by our talking of, hearing of, or remembering Him."

SB 1.10.22 p

    "But the living beings, who are constitutionally part and parcel of the Lord and are forgetful of the sweet relation, are given a chance again"

SB 1.10.28 p

    "Liberation means renovation of this stage of svarupa."

SB 1.11.8 p

    "This is the original state of the living entities and can be attained by reviving our natural and constitutional state of life."

SB 1.11.10 p

    "…the sun rays and the sun cannot be separated. The separation by the cloud is temporary and artificial, and as soon as the cloud is cleared, the sun rays again display their natural effulgence in the presence of the sun. Similarly, the living entities, who are molecular parts of the whole spirit, are separated from the Lord by the artificial covering of maya, illusory energy. This illusory energy, or the curtain of maya, has to be removed, and when it is so done, the living entity can see the Lord face to face"

Conversation, November 12, 1975

    "First you become a thief; then police is there, not that police comes and arrest you unnecessary. No. As soon as you become criminal, then police comes and arrest you. maya comes next. If you give up your natural attraction for Krishna, if you are attracted by this material enjoyment, then maya is there."

Conversation, London, July 11, 1973

    Father Tanner: Can there be opposition in the spirit world?

    Prabhupada: Yes.

    Father Tanner: Conflict in the spirit world?

    Prabhupada: Yes. Yes, yes. Just like father has got ten sons. Some of them are opposition to the father. And some of them are very obedient.

    Father Tanner: But the... I'm not saying of the spirit in man. I'm saying of spirits in themselves.

    Prabhupada: Yes. Spirit in themselves, they are not opposition.

    Father Tanner: Can they be in opposition?

    Prabhupada: No. When they are in opposition, they have to accept this material body.

Conversation, August 11, 1973

    "Is it government's fault that you go to the jail? Therefore government has fault? Why this nonsense question…It is a common sense affair."

Morning Walk, December 6, 1973

    "Because you are perfect, therefore you have got the independence to misuse. You are not a dead stone. That is perfection.

    Just like some of our students. All of a sudden, they deviate, go away. So what is that? Our movement is imperfect, or he's imperfect?....................................

    "This is nice," and goes to hell. What can be done? That independence is there. That is perfectness.

    Umapati: Well, the argument is that if God is so all-powerful, why does He even let me fall?

    Prabhupada: Eh?

    Umapati: If God is so powerful, why does He let me fall. Why doesn't He save me, save me from my own foolishness.

    Prabhupada: Yes, He's saving you, but you don't carry His order.

    Prabhupada: Yes. Just like I say, "Chant sixteen rounds." If you do not do it. What can I do?"

Lecture, SB 2.3.13-14

    "…we are also fire, in quality…we sometimes desire to imitate Krishna. Because we have got these qualities in minute quantity, so we think that "I am God, I have become." But we do not know the quantitative difference. That we forget. We can say we are God, but teeny God,"

SB 2.3.25 p

    "A complete progressive march on the return path home, back to Godhead…"

Lecture. April 14, 1972

    "In your Bible also it is said that the Adam and Eve, the forbidden apple... That means He made some rules and regulations, "Do this; do not this." And if you do this, what is not sanctioned, then you suffer. God forbade not to eat the apple—I do not know actually—but by the request of Eve, Adam ate it, and he became conditioned. Similarly—it may be story—but the fact is that God created this world. That's a fact. And He created the rules and regulation also. That is called Vedic knowledge. And in the Vedic knowledge there are injunctions: "You do this; you do not do this." If you follow the Vedic knowledge, then you have come to this world for enjoyment, so your regulated enjoyment will satisfy your senses; at the same time, you will be able to go back to home, back to Godhead, again."

Lecture, Mexico City, February 18, 1975

    "We left our home and father, and we are in this fallen material world, and we are suffering too much."

Morning Walk at Stow Lake, March 23, 1968, San Francisco

    "…to pray Krishna, "Please pick me up very soon and let me go back to Your place.'"

Bhagavad-gita 1.21-22, London, July 18, 1973

    "If one keeps his position rightly, he does not fall…a criminal, he is fallen. He has fallen down from good citizenship."

Bhagavad-gita 2.59-69, New York, April 29, 1966

    "reinstate myself in the pure spiritual life"

Bhagavad-gita 3.11-19, Los Angeles, December 27, 1968

    "go back to the kingdom of God"

Bhagavad-gita 3.16-17, New York, May 25, 1966

    "…return back to the kingdom of God"

Bhagavad-gita 3.17-20, New York, May 27, 1966

    "We have no taste for spiritual upliftment. That taste we have lost…That is the stage of our present existence—forgetfulness."

Bhagavad-gita 3.17-20, New York, May 27, 1966

    "That relationship is there, eternal. And that is congenial, and that is my real happiness. We have forgotten that.

    We have, by chance, fallen into this material contamination and we have made our relationship with so many material things, so that we have forgotten Krishna."

Bhagavad-gita 3.2, Melbourne, June 27, 1974

    "Forgetting our father, forgetting our God, we are criminal within this material world. Therefore our only business is how to get out of this prison house and go back to home, back to Godhead.

    …you are part and parcel of Krishna, or God, you being separated, I have already explained, you are suffering in this material world. So you back to your father, go back to your father and be happy.

    You forced Krishna to allow you to come. Just like sometimes a child forces his father. Father says, "My dear son, do not do this. Do not go there." But he insists, "Oh, I must go. I must go." "All right, you go at your risk. That's all."

Bhagavad-gita 3.31-43, Los Angeles, January 1, 1969 p>

    "Water is taken from the ocean, derived from the ocean. It goes to the sky, again turns into water, falls down, and in river goes down again to the ocean. Similarly, we have derived our energy from Krishna. Now again if we glide down towards Krishna, that is perfection."

Bhagavad-gita 4.1-2, Columbus, May 9, 1969 p>

    "Then your dormant relationship with God and Krishna will be revived."

Bhagavad-gita 4.3, Bombay, March 23, 1974 p>

    "The aim of life is to go back to home, back to Godhead. That is the aim of life. We are fallen in this material conditional life.

    You are My part and parcel." This is an eternal relationship. It cannot be broken, but you have forgotten. You have forgotten your relationship with Krishna

    …by forgetting God, forgetting Krishna, we are busy with the problems…"

Bhagavad-gita 4.3-6, New York, July 18, 1966 p>

    "…revive our original spiritual body, sac-cid-ananda-vigraha…The sons may forget the father, but the father cannot forget."

Bhagavad-gita 4.5, Montreal, June 10, 1968 p>

    Mahapurusha: If the living entity is in the material world and he's an expansion of the marginal energy, then he's... And he can purify himself and become eligible to enter into the spiritual world and Krishna, but can he still fall as an expansion of the marginal energy?

    Prabhupada: Yes. Marginal energy. Just like the sunshine is always there. Sometimes it is covered by cloud. When the cloud is cleared, then it is directly touching sunshine. Similarly, we are always marginal potency.

Bhagavad-gita 16.10, Hawaii, February 6, 1975 p>

    "…revive our original spiritual body. That spiritual body is within…"

The Nectar of Devotion, Bombay, January 11, 1973 p>

    "They do not know even what is God, and what the question of going back to Him, back to home, back to Godhead? They do not know everything, anything. There is God, there is home of God."

The Nectar of Devotion, Vrindavana, October 29, 1972 p>

    "The thinking, feeling, and willing... This thinking, feeling, and willing now polluted on account of material coverings. Therefore we have to revert to the thinking, feeling, and willing by Krishna consciousness."

The Nectar of Devotion, Vrindavana, October 31, 1972 p>

    "…as soon as I forget Krishna, that is the beginning of my misfortune. So in order to be, in order to become again fortunate, I have to become Krishna conscious.

    …So here in this material world, we have disagreed to serve Krishna. Therefore the whole proposal is again agree to serve Krishna. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. This is real philosophy. We disagreed; therefore we came into this material world…"

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg, May 14, 1969, Columbus, Ohio p>

    "When this service attitude is impaired, that "Why serve Krishna? Why not ourself?" that is maya. Then he falls down in the material energy"

Bhaktivedanta Book Trust


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